Owning a dog, I can appreciate the old saying about teaching old dogs new tricks. Playing in the cash game a couple of days ago I started a "discussion" with a couple of old poker players. They go way back, and I am sure that they have been playing many more years than I have. But here is the deal. I have probably played many times more hands of poker than both of them combined due to my immersion in online poker. At one point I was playing as many as 10 tournaments a day, 7 days a week. My play time, and the quickness of online poker enabled me to play more hands in a single day than live players can play in a week. So, that said, I think my experience far exceeds theirs.
Now, to the discussion. I was pointing out the error of a player's thinking on a big pot she won a few days earlier. I explained, "Another player raised to $18, I re-raised to $38, and you called with your pocket jacks. With a 10 high flop, and the board paired with 6's, my check raise of your bet screamed huge strength." She replied that she felt that she had the best hand, and illustrated it by saying "you re-raised with only 10's". That is true, however my check raise on the flop and my preflop raise could only be interpreted as a stronger hand than jacks, possible preflop and definitely after the flop. Here is why: If you pay the slightest attention to my play, I very seldom re-raise, and when I do it signals a very strong hand. It is true I was going for the isolation this particular time, but what could I possible check raise with? A/A, K/K, Q/Q , J/J , 10/10 or 6/6 is about it. Anything else, I am looking to connect strongly with the flop. Therefore, whatever I am holding beats jacks (unless I have J/J, which is possible but not probable.) A hand like A/10, K/10, Q/10, or J/10 never plays that line.
The problem with this "discussion" is that I am dealing with a level 1- 1/2 thinker. She recognizes what she has, and sometimes thinks superficially about what I might have, but never thinks about what I think what she thinks I have. In other words, she does not analyze the situation fully. The line of play I am following can never include a hand she can now beat, and her draw is pitifully thin, and unfortunately for her, came in which means she gets to repeat her mistakes in the future.
The other player is a donk who bluffs too much, chases too much, and chases with super weak holdings (in this case a 10/3 suited) that he played against a small preflop raise. I love the action, and my flopped straight was a huge favorite. His river flush draw is never good against most of my flush draws so looking forward to playing against him in the future.
My new saying is, "I would rather be sitting on a made hand than chasing any time". If you think about it that is how you make most of your money in poker. You get it in when you are ahead and give them very poor odds to chase. In the instance I mentioned, it is never profitable to chase a draw when you are heads up. Do the math.
Now, to the discussion. I was pointing out the error of a player's thinking on a big pot she won a few days earlier. I explained, "Another player raised to $18, I re-raised to $38, and you called with your pocket jacks. With a 10 high flop, and the board paired with 6's, my check raise of your bet screamed huge strength." She replied that she felt that she had the best hand, and illustrated it by saying "you re-raised with only 10's". That is true, however my check raise on the flop and my preflop raise could only be interpreted as a stronger hand than jacks, possible preflop and definitely after the flop. Here is why: If you pay the slightest attention to my play, I very seldom re-raise, and when I do it signals a very strong hand. It is true I was going for the isolation this particular time, but what could I possible check raise with? A/A, K/K, Q/Q , J/J , 10/10 or 6/6 is about it. Anything else, I am looking to connect strongly with the flop. Therefore, whatever I am holding beats jacks (unless I have J/J, which is possible but not probable.) A hand like A/10, K/10, Q/10, or J/10 never plays that line.
The problem with this "discussion" is that I am dealing with a level 1- 1/2 thinker. She recognizes what she has, and sometimes thinks superficially about what I might have, but never thinks about what I think what she thinks I have. In other words, she does not analyze the situation fully. The line of play I am following can never include a hand she can now beat, and her draw is pitifully thin, and unfortunately for her, came in which means she gets to repeat her mistakes in the future.
The other player is a donk who bluffs too much, chases too much, and chases with super weak holdings (in this case a 10/3 suited) that he played against a small preflop raise. I love the action, and my flopped straight was a huge favorite. His river flush draw is never good against most of my flush draws so looking forward to playing against him in the future.
My new saying is, "I would rather be sitting on a made hand than chasing any time". If you think about it that is how you make most of your money in poker. You get it in when you are ahead and give them very poor odds to chase. In the instance I mentioned, it is never profitable to chase a draw when you are heads up. Do the math.
3 comments:
I know it was Maryann that beat you with the jacks & she is old school and perhaps she doesn't think enough, but having said that - I think we've all been there and done that. There are more times than I care to think about when I thought my KK or AQ was good on a queen high board even after thinking about it. Sometimes you just have to pay people off and if they beat you on the river - that's poker. I'm not saying it's good play - just that it's understandable in some cases.
As for chasing - these days if I can see the turn fairly cheaply I will go for it. If I don't hit on the turn I throw the draw away 99% of the time. I've noticed that this is saving me quite a bit of money.
The particular player paid $20 to see the turn. Donk!
As to the KK or AQ, yes, sometimes against some players it is good. But you have to think about the line of play, like when I threw my kings away on a queen high flop in the Sunday tournament. Given the line of play, my raise, his re-raise pre-flop, then the board with a Q & J, there is no way my kings are good....thus I folded. Could I have hit a king on the river...maybe, but very poor odds.
Very true. I try to do that. I have folded QQ more than once when I bet out to find out where I was and got reraised. I guess Maryann just didn't believe you!!
Who is this old school donk you speak of? I must pay more attention I guess.
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